Exploring the Intersection Between AI and Humanity (Episode 181)

Jeff Bullas

00:00:06 - 00:01:54

Hi, everyone and welcome to The Jeff Bullas Show. Today, I have with me Tony Greenberg and I do love Tony's background there. It looks like from a Harry Potter movie, looks like a man cave, but it's really cool. So a little bit about Tony, he's the founder and CEO of RampRate. He helps Fortune 500 startups looking to make a purpose driven impact in the world while simultaneously addressing how to integrate AI and Metaverse, Blockchain, Edge Computing, another emerging innovation in their business and to realize the potential of today's innovation and impact. Since 2000, RampRate has worked with hundreds of world renowned organizations, Microsoft, Sony, eBay, Merrill Lynch, and more and new companies in emerging markets are like to achieve and succeed in their business goals. RampRate's vision is to build an ecosystem of impact-preneurs and trailblazers powered by opportunities, resources, innovation and human spirit. Today, Tony's ability to recognize and stay at the forefront of emerging business trends has been his key to RampRate’s success. So, welcome to the show, Tony, it's an absolute pleasure to have you here and we're gonna talk a little bit about your take on the capitalist system that you are basically involved with and business that is in a very holistic way, which we've just talked about the purpose driven impact that RampRate does we find out where you want. So, Tony, after you went and did a degree and then after that, how did you get into being an entrepreneur first and then you became a risk reductionist next? So how did you become an entrepreneur? What drove that?

Tony Greenberg

00:01:55 - 00:03:30

Well, first of all, if you talk about the three degree I got, I only gave the third degree. I never and I got the third degree, but I never really got a degree. You know, I did my temperature taken once in a variety of places. Mom did a good job of making sure that I didn't have too much problems up there in the head. But the degree, I’m actually a PhD in art, con art or con artistry. So my real business is sales which is in his essence is enabling decisions. People like to turn it into something else. Manipulating spending, getting people to lead, getting people to buy that got nothing to do with selling. Selling is simply enabling decisions. And if you take a look at that and in the words of Jeff Pink, who did a wonderful TED talk where everybody's a salesperson. The minute we say oh, we don't like that or we don't like it. We're not like that or we're embarrassed. There's nothing more honorable than carrying a bag. So whether I was selling mobile homes when I was a kid or timeshare condos or I've done through the restructure of multibillion dollar deals and driven strategies for multibillion dollar acquisitions by Microsoft and eBay and PayPal and, you know, all sorts of in between everything is selling. So when they win the day and we really want to get our stuff going, we figure out how to communicate our ideas, how to enable decisions of others around us so that we can flow in the universe and be here to be of service to each other.

Jeff Bullas

00:03:31 - 00:03:48

Yeah, I like the word flow that you just use right then. And in terms of sales, I totally agree with you. I left teaching to become a salesperson. So I've been facilitating decisions for quite a long time and it's, yeah.

Tony Greenberg

00:03:49 - 00:03:59

Enabling, not facilitating. Facilitating is proactive, enabling is it is allowing natural revenue and nat ural decisions to be made.

Jeff Bullas

00:03:59 - 00:04:28

So enabling the flow. Okay, cool. Yeah. I reflect on my life and I sometimes I think about when the bad things happened, it was where I was trying to force things, the good things happened where I just let it flow and I'd be interested in your take on that actually. Let's talk about flow because you use that word. And obviously, it's important to you. So enabling flow. So what do you mean by flow?

Tony Greenberg

00:04:29 - 00:04:52

Flow is of the river, right? I'm not a salmon, I'm not gonna fight uphill. In Taoist tradition, I, you know, I was born a Jew, but I had to go study over the world's religion to see what I wanted to decide how to design a more, you know, Taoist. And that's really of the river of the flow, you know, find the current and go beyond it if it's called drafting on a bike, you know.

Jeff Bullas

00:04:52 - 00:04:54

Join the Peloton.

Tony Greenberg

00:04:55 - 00:08:33

Yeah. So, if we talk about flow, first of all, it's easy, much more easy to talk about than to do, right? And the discipline of going where the puck is headed as per well is not just fighting and creating your discipline. I mean, breaking every rule in the book is everything I've ever done. I don't know anything else in that, but there's a lot of ways to allow truth and value to be created. So when we talk about creating value, I really talk about not deciding, you know, in a management philosophy book that may say, are you more customer to meet lowest cost manufacturer or most innovative? I think what we're talking about is how you can participate in the greater benefiting of all things from your ecosystem, to your team, to yourself and to the universe and to human rights as a whole. And so once we hit that beautiful balance, they call it a syzygy which is the name of my foundation, S-Y-Z-Y-G-Y. You'll never remember it but syzygy was a very, very important, wonderful word that when I looked it up and I wanted to get it because the alignment to the celestial bodies, Jeff, the Earth, moon, the sun. And I was just fascinated with this, how cool this word was and I looked it up and funny to me, a friend of mine, the ever impressionable, always amenable, amazing, beautiful man named Nolan Bushnell, the creator of Atari and Chucky Bed, Chuck E Cheese and things of that nature had registered the name inside of the trademark and then it elapsed and I somehow took it over. Well, I said, Nolan, you really gotta, we gotta gotta know what's behind this. The guy that made Atatri, Chuck E Cheese, I wanna know why you call this syzygy?. And hey, Nolan, I get to tell this story. So he says, well, Tony, I said, I think you're gonna have to, we're gonna have to go out to dinner for this and we're gonna go to the, you know, that Mezcalria Hawke restaurant you've been talking about and we can have a serious conversation. So I get all my generals out there. We went in there and then no one came in there and we had done, we had two, three margaritas and the margaritas and eventually says Nolan, I need to know, the taxonomy, how the word came about, how this became the name of your first company. And about the time that Steve Jobs was working for you, he said I was in Palo Alto. I was sitting around with my friends. We were deciding what to call the company being very serious. So we pulled out a huge joint and smoked it and we said, I wonder what the f the last word in the S is in the dictionary. And I said I had to buy you dinner to get that. But in that state where there's the Earth, the moon, the sun that's aligning, it's not an eclipse, it's actually true value like it's just alignment and so aligning with your ecosystem. And I like to do it in trees, allows unconditional value to come out. And if I learned that a long time ago, I'd probably be even doing better today for them. I'm doing okay. Alignment.

Jeff Bullas

00:08:34 - 00:08:52

Alignment, okay. So let's wind back. So what, you're still a salesperson that enables decisions to be made. What was your first entrepreneurial adventure? And how did that start? What was the inspiration?

Tony Greenberg

00:08:54 - 00:10:56

You know? So I don't have to talk about it too much. You can look up Tony Greenberg Virtual Soul India. I got a crazy blog at tonygreenberg.com. If you really wanna go is tea for real. And I work for an Indian gentleman who allowed me to borrow colored stones and I put them on my bike in Minnesota and sold them to people. And then eventually I somehow became, you know, a dealer of vintage eyeglasses. And then I built a chain of eyeglass stores of the super super boutique type and I sold them at age 28 and wonderful, wonderful stores. We had a company called Custom Color Gallery where we added wood leather paint rhinestones, custom colors and plating to strange eye wear and did every celebrity under the sun including like all the prince's bands and all their people stuff and since Elton John and did everything else and it was super fun and I got rid of that in 28 and I moved to Aspen, Colorado, took a couple of years off this thing and the internet was started and joined an amazing group of Indian entrepreneurs and we built something called Internet Data Centers for Collocation and continued to change my stripes and be involved in the compute industry for many years. And then they moved into where they make computers which is Blockchain and where they make, you know, these Bitcoins, you know, they make them in computers, right? And then I started seeing how decentralization could affect the world and studied a lot of decentralized governance and been hooked on breaking up hierarchies and bad stuff and working on impact mission and driven businesses and helping them bring value and seeing some of those businesses together with, you know, my Fortune 500 Chiefs. It's the short story.

Jeff Bullas

00:10:56 - 00:11:00

Cool. So, you've had a very eclectic business background.

Tony Greenberg

00:11:00 - 00:11:02

Are you telling me I can't keep a job?

Jeff Bullas

00:11:03 - 00:11:59

Well, I think you may be not horrible, very easily. Which I sort of very, very closely identified to. I see my partner go after work, she works in a corporate law and I sit at home and sort of play and work online. Been doing it for 13 years. I'm un-horrible as well. So it's, I think it's a value to be embraced. So we need more vagabonds that actually roam the Earth and take a path less traveled as they say. So, it sounds like you've been a little bit like the Knights of the Holy Grail or they struck, went into the forest where there was no path, which sounds like very much what you've done. You've created your own path, which is, I think being true to you, which is fabulous.

Tony Greenberg

00:12:00 - 00:12:35

I think I've had this unerring belief system that at any given time that you ask me a question. And the answer is no, you've asked them the wrong question. And I guess in format to that, I may also say that when my friends say Tony, you are the most driven man I've ever met in my entire life. And I always say I have no idea where I'm driving and they say one thing worse than a moron but a driven moron. And here I am attempting to save the universe in a haphazard way, having some fun and doing some good work.

Jeff Bullas

00:12:36 - 00:13:12

Yeah, which sounds very much like what you've done. And in Australia, we might also call it keeping the bastards honest. So, which means I suppose trying to find the real purpose behind what you do as a business as well as an individual. Now, can we tell us a bit more like you use the word impact a lot. So, purpose driven, impact businesses or making sure that, can you explain more about impact what you mean, what's meant by that in your terms?

Tony Greenberg

00:13:13 - 00:16:09

Well, you know, I wish I had a more articulate answer and there's many, many different ways to measure the impact outcomes or the benefits of society or to the members of the constituency and ecosystem or shareholders. And I've gone about my merry way trying to figure out how to create an extensible index to measure the benefits or the impacts of these particular situations. I even went as far as to go crazy and become something called B Lab Certified, which is like, you know, if you were like Patagonia or Whole Foods or Ben and Jerry's and you, like, really cared more about the world than you did about yourself in your checkbook. You'd become one of these B Lab Certified companies. So I'm an elite member of 4000 companies, out of a hundred thousand people, companies in the world that have tried that are actually doing great work, measuring what we're doing and reporting what we're doing. So impact and impact ROI can be measured across a variety of disciplines. When people say I'm impactful in the world or I'm charity driven or I'm this or that, it's okay. Tell me how, tell me what that looks like and I use your ROI around the definition of what you're going to do is if the investment rate of return as per created by Warren Buffett's nephew Howard is the impact rate of return based on, you know, a calculation of benefit against investment. Is it a corporate social responsibility about how you run your business and how you manage your staff and your team and your philanthropic management and your equalities or is it about what is the materiality or benefit to the people you serve, right? All these have different measurements. So I've sort of like put them into a soup and next year in the beginning of the first que one will be releasing this extensible impact measurement so that people can actually know what they've done, know where they've invested, know what they've performed. And then one of my companies that I co-founded with Dr. Wulf Kaal, which is called Menagerie. The wilding up of round animals at menagerie.is. We built a decentralized community software to turn your passion into pay and to start shifting the way corporate psychopaths can start putting the power in the hands of the people that matter. So between B Corp Certified and building decentralized government software, which is kind of dull ask decentralized autonomous organization. My life is around making sure that benefit gets as equally to shareholders and employees and to the environment and to human rights.

Jeff Bullas

00:16:10 - 00:16:16

So I haven't heard the term before, B Certified Company. What does B mean?

Tony Greenberg

00:16:16 - 00:16:29

So, you know, without going too deep into it, I would just go to B labs. B Lab Certification, use the keyword and learn about that. It's a benefit corporation.net.

Jeff Bullas

00:16:30 - 00:16:32

B means benefit.

Tony Greenberg

00:16:32 - 00:17:31

Yeah, means benefit, yeah. And you learn about E Corp Certification which is very different than benefit corpse. It's unfortunate they use the same word with a lot of difficulties. But if you sort of take a look at the discipline under which that we create value in our ecosystem, that's, you know what I'm kind of down and spend a lot of time on it for a few years. So that's much as I can go into the impact today. But we're mission aligned. If somebody wants to know about us, I say go to ramprate.com/values and discusses and articulates how we operate our business to who and why and to what benefit. And once you start defining all those, the characters of your business, really start to change and shift and your whole persona and how your company operates starts to shift. I've been in that for about four years.

Jeff Bullas

00:17:31 - 00:17:39

Okay. So tell us a little bit more about the values of RampRate. Can you, is it a long list? Is it a short list?

Tony Greenberg

00:17:40 - 00:19:32

I mean, it's too long, right? But if you do ramprate.com/the values, I look at it every day. It's important to, to say that, you know, as you mentioned, we build an ecosystem of impact-preneurs and trailblazers powered by opportunities, resources, innovation and we serve others. We choose who we work with. We deal in rationality and pragmatism, we dream big, we support execution, we earn trust, we overdeliver on our promises, we support diversity, equity and inclusion. We are engines of transparency. You see, we believe in the transformational power of tech and innovation. Not all that new is better, rigorous evaluation and audit of every new technology, tokenomics of new tokens and real health effects of every new therapy, we embrace personalization. We're bold, we accelerate or do growth strategy and implementation for earlier stage companies, finding them, vetting them, optimizing them. We do general boutique business planning and consultancy. We do social impact consulting, not just you know, how do you buy carbon credits, but what is the real strategic sustainability in the non financial reporting of outcome measurement? How do you manage your supply chain? How do we manage deep expertise on industry spaces, maintain a profound broad network of sector leading experts? Why? Because we have a moral obligation, we have an awareness of the changing landscape because of DNA. Because with tech recreates and enables an environment for high impact projects and the industry, we use it for the industries that need it most, the dirtiest industries, the corporate managers, the budget savings, the people who want to live with their values at work period. Dreamers.

Jeff Bullas

00:19:33 - 00:19:55

Dreamers. That's a big list. So how do you position the company? Like if you're basically enabling decisions when you are talking to corporations, how do you describe in a sentence what you do?

Tony Greenberg

00:19:56 - 00:25:25

Well, what we do is say, tell me more. The three most powerful potent words in the English language because when companies come to us, they say, well, we are really just trying to raise money. No, you're not. You're maybe failing to raise money or failing to attract capital or failing to be relevant or failing to recognize your position in the marketplace. You're probably failing to understand your unique selling proposition. You're probably doing everything, you know, you're saying, you know, unfortunately, I, you know, I went to the bathroom on the floor. No, you just didn't wear diapers, okay? Tell me about the root cause and then we talk about why you can't manage this. I'm being absurd, but the point is everybody always talks about what they think they need or what they want, whether it's Microsoft, wanting to grow into content or whether it's Sony wanted to move digital or whether it's Mckenzie wanted to figure out how to deliver infrastructure or whether a data center company wanted to be energy as impact, you know, all these people, they generally come to us with their problems and we say those are not your problems, those are your solutions. And then we say, tell me more and then we say, show me your 10 magic tricks, the 10 things that you think I could do that would allow you to be successful, prosper, be innovative and flourish and be in flow. And they go, well, you know, we wanna talk to any company that does this. No no. Which company? Why? What you studied about them? Why are you telling me that they're a target of yours? How have you made it easy for them to say yes? Well, we just think, I don't care what you think, neither do they, there's an articulate answer about why someone will have a natural flow and a natural integration to buy things from you and make you happy because you're delivering something to them that they need, not what you think they need. So we really drill down to the core of a company, whether it's large or small and not figure out what they think their problem is. We get on to know that that's their solution. And then we reverse backwards and we build the ecosystem, we build the advisors, we build the structure, we build the unique selling proposition. We make their business plan pragmatic. We teach them to have an alpha customer versus building, they'll come and then in turn, when they're ready and they've been ready to leave the nest, then we'll build a wonderful group of advisors that will shepherd them through the world and participate, not be names on a bus on a website or a deck and then will help drive the value that they get together and they want to report, right? And at any given time that they don't want to do an impact statement or impact measurement in any given time, they want to do it their way. And they just say no, we just need some introductions, we say have a nice day because you're not gonna be entering mine. So our role is to find companies that are super, super curious about where they're headed or where they wanna go. And they're willing to do the work, to change their stripes and to feel beneficial to the rest of the universe by defining their impact mission, figuring out what their product and services are, how and to who they're benefiting them and how we can knock it out of the park and make enough money so where a philanthropic goals are met also. So, and we get to say no to most of the companies, but they do say yes. It's just a beautiful natural fit. I had one today that just we tried to get them out of there and they eventually we had no choice but to say yes, they were mission aligned, right? They knew what they were headed, they knew who their customers were, they knew who they wanted to sell, wanted to buy. And then we said this is easy work and they said, does that mean your price goes down? I said, no, it's the reason why we said yes, because we do like to get checks. But the reason why we said yes is because I'm not going to struggle, right? To try to chase you around trying to tell you what to do if you would innately don't understand who you're solving for, what into, what benefit into whom. If you don't know that you really want to know that, that's great. If you just want to raise money or sell some more stuff, have a nice day. Make your business the 34th Street. So that's how we do it and we do grants, matchmaking. We granted $4 million and 100 million tokens to Xprize Foundation and Peter Diamandis. And we're building tools to decentralize one of the best kept secrets in the world. Xprize Foundation that, you know, leverages, you know, reasonably large sums of money, 10 and 100 of them to create stuff like, you know, private space travel or clean up the carbon in the world or stopping forest fires or, you know, audacious shifting and we'll continue to grant money and allocate to those through our grant matchmaking organization. So those are the fun things we get to do.

Jeff Bullas

00:25:25 - 00:25:49

That's very cool. And I do like the fact is that if it looks like a struggle, you're gonna have to force things, it's not gonna work because it's always gonna be a struggle, and I do really like that. It took me 50 years to learn about this. I'm not just gonna struggle anymore. I'm just gonna let it flow and keep stepping into the river and we're gonna be swimming downstream and upstream.

Tony Greenberg

00:25:50 - 00:28:48

I watched the Nike show about Michael Jordan and that your shoe means nothing until my son steps in it and it was beautiful and people that live within their DNA. It's just wonderful to work with. It was such a dream, working with Microsoft and eBay mission driven and I have an investment of mine, Dean Nelson is an amazing lawyer, an impact lawyer and he's created, you know, carbon negative compute with Cato, one of my investments, he's a huge mentor and a friend. I bowed down to a guy named Will Poole who was my client a hundred times over at Microsoft. He was running something called Windows and reporting to Balmer and Gates. And I'm happy to be an investor in his fund called Capri and Unite Us that only funds underprivileged entrepreneurs in foreign countries because we got enough money in the US. And he's an amazing impact warrior. The first guy who wrote the Segway to work back when they called it a ginger and, you know, my mentors are few and far in between, but they're people that really live in and with their purpose. And another person I learned a lot from was Richard Condon. He was the leader of something called the Landmark Forum, which is a little bit of an odd organization. But, you know, he's an ontological expert and he's helping tribal associations in Peru to get along with each other. And, you know, brings me to some of the other stuff I do in decentralized medicine. I've been a part of driving a discipline, an adoption of something called Nagoya Protocol, N-A-G-O-Y-A, which originally founded in Gabon where the neuros substance in medicine called iboga and iboga is created and we work in several areas in Peru and in Africa doing tribal reparation contracts and we're working with supply chain on the medicine. We're working with supply chain on their, on their creative things that they make, the textiles and art. And that's, you know, and we're trying to leverage a lot of things in medicine that shortcut people's path towards a healed state, whether it's a mental state which is epidemic or whether it's addiction or whether it's neurological dysfunction or Parkinson's. These are things that are merging through the merged essence of botanicals and synthetic medic and synthetic medicines. So kind of deeply involved in that space also.

Jeff Bullas

00:28:49 - 00:29:09

So you cover a lot of areas. Is there like if you're talking to organization, how do you identify, what are the priorities because you can't do it all? In terms of, is there a priority list of impact areas that you focus on or is that dependent upon the organization's target audience and category?

Tony Greenberg

00:29:10 - 00:30:07

We score them. We're balance scorecard freaks. I could flash a couple at you if you like or I can send you some links. But, you know, the spy in the and intelligence in desk which drove restructuring of IT contracts for 20 years total billions and billions of dollars was all data driven sourcing analytics. And so we do that and we believe that there is a consensus building mechanism called data that's super important. And even today in our matchmaking business for grants to block from blockchains and large family foundations, we score them based on, you know, leverage value, brand value, impact value. You know, we drill down to the balance scorecard and try to rationalize ourselves. So we don't believe in what people think, we believe in what we can prove.

Jeff Bullas

00:30:08 - 00:30:55

Okay. That sounds awesome. I'm gonna take a deeper dive. If you could send some links through later, that would be good. We'll include them. That would be really cool. Because see we, what you talk about is very, very rarely mentioned or discussed, which is I think is fantastic. Now, I know you've got a bit of you, you got a hard stop coming up. Just to wrap this up. I actually, I've been asking this question of my guests and you can answer it if you like or you can dance around it or give me a straight honest answer, which I'm sure you will is, what brings Tony joy?

Tony Greenberg

00:30:56 - 00:31:15

My asset. Well, first of all, there's this strawberry yeast sake that I'm very excited to open up at some point in time after I get rid of you. So sake, which is the most nutritional spirit in the world, amino acid food chain.

Jeff Bullas

00:31:15 - 00:31:18

So, what's the name of the sake?

Tony Greenberg

00:31:18 - 00:39:16

This particular one is, you know, a bunch of Japanese on it. But Amabuki Ichigo Junmai Ginjo and it's a nama which is unpasteurized, which means it only lasts about a month in the refrigerator. And it has a beautiful, amazing essence driven by a strawberry fermentation process. But while I'm not much of a drinker, I do like to play around with things of magnificence and purity and the Japanese don't know how to do that really well. But what drives me value is to being of service to my brethren and to the powers that be love, having the gift of applying disparate connections to create exponential value. The fact that I can merely put one person together with another, not as a connector, right? But it really machining an exponential value, right? Introducing people is nothing. You just gotta look at how you look at people, you got people, you know, people you've done business with, that’s two different types that's very binary. Oh I know this guy with me or this guy. No, there's a wonderful article I wrote called, if I do say so myself, Mastering Business Development by Tony Greenberg. And it kind of talks about how I see the world as a sales guy and how careful I am with each person. Like if I only, Jeff, with something important here in this meeting and I've wasted your time, it's a mark against me. If I introduce somebody to somebody else on the auspices of doing business and they don't, that's a scar against me. If I refer somebody to fund a company that I don't know much about and they decide not to have or have a bad conversation. That's a scar against me. So if we really want this sporadic function of betterment and value creation, we have to be very, very conscious about how you introduce people, how you connect the dots and how you make those values and reverse them. So that the article talks step by step about how to really become a master of business development. And, you know, like attorneys and like accountants, you know, they talk about their practice because we're never perfect and my practice is getting better and being more of service. What is driving me is, you know, in life, you can need to be a one-to-one person where you create value in that one person, like a mother to a child or to few, which should be a company or create philosophies and distinctions that will allow mass people to adopt it. So I'm hoping at this stage in my life that I could create something of massive value that allows people to measure their impact, be conscious of it and to stop hand waving and making things up. And program is coming online in Q-One and we hope to prove out understand where they're headed with the impact that they're creating, be able to communicate to themselves, to their foundations, to their grant doors, to their parents, to their kids. You know, it's interesting. One of our partners runs the largest family office distribution mechanism for philanthropy in the world got about 600 employees. And he said, you know what, your business is a piece of mine. He said, oh, my clients, the most biggest form names in the world. They don't wanna be heard, they don't wanna be bothered. They don't want to be known. Anonymous to, you know, to dance like when no one's looking. So, the untold foundation of trillions of dollars that's unlocking in the world is not going to have Bill Gates's name on it. The things that a Bill Gates does or that everybody else in the world, you see the top line stuff, but the stuff that are really impact, you'll never hear about it. It's a tree falling in the forest, and finding the way to nourish your cells and the Earth and your brethren and your other companies and being a value to people. That will not be something that you'll run around with the management menagerie impact certificate on. But it's a great start to be conscious and as we head towards this beautiful thing called singularity, you know, pioneered by Ray Kurzweil, who I got to speak underneath at Harvard. What, you know, when we look at all of the stuff that I learned from Ray 20 years ago, honestly, this AI, that's all I was ever talking about. The biggest problem with AI in case any has anybody figured it out and everyone talked about the evil, this and the evil that and the, that, that, that, that. That is the fact that once they're all working together, we all get the same answer. That's the problem. We all got the same answer. Now, what are we gonna do? How are we gonna make a living, right? Worry about the process of thinking is I sat there with a friend trying to create a poem the other day and I'm way better at querying the AI engine than almost anyone, right? I can get more stuff out of that thing. I can get a better poem and people say is that ChatGPT? I'll tell you what you go write a poem, you come back with your ChatGPT poem and I'll give you mine, okay? I mean, I'm the rapping Jew and I know just what to do is a Scooby Doo. So learn how to query the chat and learning to apply it to the benefit of humanity is the most potent thing and in the world where the answers become the same. That is the singularity where man meets machine meets animals and the transhuman humanitarians, you know, have got some of these things right. Not everything goes perfect because as a matter of fact, when you create all this data and you upload your mind, well, guess what? You still got Comcast and Verizon, it's gonna charge you a lot of damn money. So how to decentralize these telecoms? I have a wonderful company called Syntropy. If you know anything about blockchain it, you know, blockchain, you know with the ethereum is gas for transactions. Well, Syntropy is gas for data and everybody is old data is big, you know, everything in the actually, the data need to be owned by the human that created it, whether it's a healthcare anonymous, healthcare wallet which has been run by a portfolio company mine called Vatom, V-A-T-O-M or whether it's Jeff from radical science, Chen who is recreating the next generation, what do you call it, next generation clinical trial or whether it's quantified citizen who's primarily invested by Paul Stamets, the the mushroom god that's actually doing pre and post psychedelic and micro dosing interventions on physiological and cognitive and neurology exams on your phone. Any of these things are all focused on finding unique answers and creating unique value as they weave together. So I'm super excited about all these people working on solutions that are the antagonistic view of one answer, the singularity itself.

Jeff Bullas

00:39:17 - 00:40:03

That's absolutely fascinating. And we just been reading a book called, nearly finished it, called Here Lie Monsters, which is about the intersection of humanity and technology, which is a quite different view. And another book I've just started is called Precipice, so I, we live in very, very interesting times where, you know, AI is starting to make its presence felt. And I've been working in technology since the PC revolution in the 1800s. And I've enjoyed it for so much because it's just the evolution of humanity is happening at a rapid rate and sometimes it's our ability to handle that rapid rate becomes a challenge.

Tony Greenberg

00:40:04 - 00:40:37

Yeah, it's all the same stuff we keep talking about the challenges since AI this AI that let me tell you something, it's all the same crap. It just keeps getting better and better and we got to get smarter and smarter and that's just what it all is. And thank God, we got the most powerful human brains and the computer will never be as powerful as us because we have a heart and we'll be able to emulate that and emulate compassion and empathy and all the things that make us human. It's at the end of the day, it's gonna be who we hug, how we hug them and how they feel when we're done hugging them.

Jeff Bullas

00:40:38 - 00:41:18

That is awesome. And it sounds to me like you are asking a lot of questions and asking the right questions and it's about being more human in the world of technology that is rushing past us. So, thank you Tony for trying to wrap humanity and into what we do as humans. I think it's really important. So thank you very much for your antagonistic and very interesting insights that I've enjoyed immensely and I'd love to one day have a sake with you and have a chat for more than 40 minutes. So, thank you very much for your time. It's been an absolute pleasure mate.

Tony Greenberg

00:41:18 - 00:41:21

Have a gorgeous day, my friend. See you.